Thursday, September 25, 2008

So Angry!

I love my brother. I really, truly do. I know he doesn't believe it...we try hard to work through see the same side of the road....but for some reason, we have managed to move further apart on things that really have little to do with "us" as brothers. We are both passionate about our much so...we will never be able to appriciate each other's point of view - and that is I try not to involve myself with these types of conversation with my brother....and it's been working (until the past few days....).

My brother and I do not see eye to eye on very much. Ok-we don't agree on anything really...but we do agree on one thing...the bailout that is currently being considered is WRONG. That said, we disagree as to how we got to this point (nothing new there. To put it in perspective, you should read his posts as of late....blame the democrats ...and oh, yeah, by the way Bush wasn't strong enough to stand up to the bullying he is a little to blame as well...(whatever!)

So I read his blog...even though it really angered me to my core (so I'm an emotional, sappy, liberal)....and I made a few responses,. My brother then stated that I was being "pompus" (but he used the big word "bloviate" ...and i'm elitist???)and accused me of not reading through his analysis to the end. So...angered, yet again, I responded (DAMMIT!!)..and here is my response:

We do agree on this. But as I stated earlier - you still want to lay blame with the Democrats. Your President has presided over some of the most disasterous policies this country has ever seen....he has been a FAILURE. Yet, Obama (and McCain aren't leaders -they are populists?) What does that make Bush..besides the obvious IDIOT and FAILURE?

This economic "SHOCK" as Naomi Klein aptly describes it, is a scare tactic devised by the same people that gave us the buildup to war with Iraq. "Grave Danger" "Impending Doom"...etc, etc...fear fear fear. Ridiculous!

The fact that we are even discussing a "bailout" has me ready to burst at the seams. So - while we agree that the bailout is the wrong answer to this problem - we disagree on how we got to this point in the first place...

And why is it the Democrat's fault that they didn't "push back" enough on the ruling party when these changes took place in 1999? IT WAS YOUR PARTY THAT WAS IN CONTROL!!!!!!!!!!!!

Yet again, the Republican Party bears no responsibilty for what has happend. And yet again I say...shame on them.

The buck stops with the current you faithfully helped get elected and that you so staunchily defended on several occassions....let's really see who is taking from the the middle class .....sounds like your argument of redistribution of wealth (that you always preach to me) has been going on ...just in the opposite direction - and with all of us holding the bag!

I am sorry that you think I am the pompus one here ...interesting considering that you are always pontificating the merits of the Republican Party ...well - your party is the party that brought us to the table where we currently Cheers!

Yes, you do slightly blame Bush, but he is only guilty of "not being stronger" on the issue..What?

I did read your complete analysis....I respectfully believe that you look through glasses that paint a one-sided view of the entire situation. There is enough blame to go around. But the blame ulitmately lies with this administration. So, I will not apologize for speaking out....I love you Jimmy - but you stand on the wrong side of the "blame" issue here.

I promised myself that I would not get ensnared in these arguments with you - I really try...but I am sick and tired of this administration and the Republican party not taking responsibility for what has transpired over the past 7 years.

Our country is in dire straits. you can continue to believe that 40 years of Democratic rule has caused this (funny considering that the republicans have run Congress since 1994 until 2006...12 years! With a number of those years having the White House and the Supreme Court as well.) But this mess lays squarely on the policy positions of your party...."free markets" government regulation. This is where that gets us.



Jim-the Classical Liberal (Views from the Right) said...

"I know he doesn't believe it"

Wrong...I know it.

As for your response...I posted one myself to yours.

I hope you are thanking your lucky stars for the conservative Republicans in the House who have (at least for now) derailed this HORRIBLE bailout plan! You should check out DJ McGuire's latest on this (more partisan than I, but a good analysis)

Does it matter that it was the wind that knocked down the house when the foundation was weakened to the point that a stiff breeze could take it down? The fundamental and foundational problem that led to all of the financial crisis we are seeing now was the CRA and Fannie and Freddie!

I also mentioned in another response that B. J. Clinton pointed out that in retrospect, his decisions on Fannie and the CRA may indeed have been wrong:

"On GMA this morning (Thursday 9/25) responding to a question about the changes to Fannie and Freddie in 1999, BJ Clinton said, "Well...I think the responsibility the Democrats have may rest more in resisting any efforts by Republicans in the put some standards and tighten up a little on Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac.""

Jenny said...

Boys, boys, boys, take a breath. In the end whoever becomes president will be there for four possibly eight years and you will be brothers for life. This to shall pass albeit with very rocky roads ahead no matter which side of the divide you are on. I will say it again, for the most part I believe Americans are slightly to the right and/or left of middle ground. I believe for the most part that both everyday democrats and republicans and independents have the same concerns, safety, security (both financially and militarily), education, taxes, health care, gas prices. We may not agree how to fix these things, but we can agree that there are issues that need addressed in all these areas. The problem stems from the people in power (either democrat or republican) appealing to their extreme sides and claiming that they speak for everyone in their respective parties. Sensationalism is what wins, unfortunately we really don't need more drama in our lives. I can tell you my cup is overflowing right now! I love you both very much and I know you know it :).

Jodi said...

I just thought of something that might help. While we all take this far too personally, Jim, you use a certain tactic because you think it's funny but you do it more so to get everyone angry. "BJ Clinton," really?? Come on! And the repeated reference to Obama as "the one" continues to frustrate me. And the reason is that you want to get under our skin, you want to be annoying, and you want us to argue with you. We aren't going to agree and we are going to debate that is healthy, but calling people names is kid stuff!

Anonymous said...

Hi Nonners What a mess. I love you all so much that sometimes it hurts and I do not want any of intentionally hurting the other and I have decided to keep my stance as We all may disagree at one time or another and it does not make any of us bad. We see things differently sometimes, sometimes agree on things, and I want us to love each other ins pite of holding different and valid views. I am proud of how you try to have conversations but all of us myself included need to stop trying to convince those who do not agree that they are wrong. I hope I can do it.. There are so many other and more productive ways to support the views you hold. Love Mom PS I guess I need to let Jon know that as this evolved I am talking to all of you and not just Jon. Take what works for you and let the rest go. Comon Kids.

Jim-the Classical Liberal (Views from the Right) said...

Look, guys...

I am not angry and do not take John's comments (nor any of your comments) personally. I may think you are wrong and am not shy to tell you so (and support my reasoning). This is a debate and we have diverging views on many points (although, we do both agree that this bailout is wrong--albeit for very different reasons).

I have also tried throughout this to support my views with evidence collected from many sources (and I give the links so you can read for yourselves).

As for Jodi's comment...I cannot help that our former president's name is Bill Jefferson Clinton...I am just using his initials, not calling names. As for The One...what? Don't you believe that he is the one with the answers, the one for change, the one you want...He certainly does!

Love you all (even if you are all wild-eyed liberals)!

Jenny said...

You can't help yourself can you. In fact, I can see you now sitting back with a grin on your face as you type "but his name is Bill Jefferson. His initial would be WJC as his first name is William and not Bill. I think you secretly admire him because you have the same approach to semantics. Wasn't it President Clinton that said, "it depends on what your definition of is, is". This is how both parties can make any statistical info. appear to be in their favor. Oh, McCain does it brilliantly too, "the fundamentals of our economy are sound"...Everyone else was talking about the finacial ideology that generates the day to day economy, McCain (of course...bullshit...opps did I type that) meant the fundamentals of the economy are the American people and they are strong. Please!!!
Love to all,